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 Headlamp dip switch
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LewPalmer

USA
2555 Posts

Posted - 28/06/2020 :  17:55:10  Show Profile
On all my later cars, the horn push switch had an integral headlamp dipping switch. However, on the M, there is no sign of the head lamp dip switch.
Could some kind soul please post a photo of what one looks like and where it is located?
My horn push looks like this:






Lew Palmer
PA1169, 2M1281

Reinout

USA
127 Posts

Posted - 28/06/2020 :  18:38:47  Show Profile
The M-Type wiring diagram in my copy of the Blower manual does not show a horn, or a horn switch. There is only an "O/S HLamp Switch". The diagrams for the Occasional Four and the D-Type have the "Horn Switch" and the "Dipper Switch" right next to one another in the diagram. Emma has a horn and the push button has an integrated dipper handle, which might indicate that it came from a D or a Four? Or, did the later cars have a horn and the combo push-button/dip-switch? Hopefully someone will post a photo of an original O/S HLamp Switch.

Sorry, the photo is rotated CCW by 90º






Reinout Vogt
Emma
1931 M-Type 2M/2735

Edited by - mgmog on 30/06/2020 08:57:35
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Malcolm Eades

United Kingdom
353 Posts

Posted - 28/06/2020 :  20:54:26  Show Profile
Lew,

Originally the M Type did not have a dip function as such, merely a simple switch that extinguished the offside headlight. This was near the bottom of the dash panel to the left of the steering column, but Im afraid I don't have a photo. I think it was just a pull-on switch with a knob. Over the years, owners have modified these arrangements to update them. The original horn button is generally shown mounted under the upper right edge of the scuttle but, as in Reinout's case, owners found it convenient to combine horn and dip on the dash, using the later switch, which does not look out of place.

Malcolm
M Type

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sam christie

United Kingdom
2425 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2020 :  13:17:00  Show Profile














I confess I have only ever been able to detect a 'dimming control' of any kind in period pictures on late M-types. Could this be the reason it does not feature in the wiring diagrams?

Sam
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LewPalmer

USA
2555 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2020 :  15:09:34  Show Profile
Thanks, everyone. In Sam's second picture, the "Dimming Control" is shown, but the standard diming switch look is still unclear. And Reinout's photo is apparently the more modern version. Does anyone know what the original looked like?

Lew Palmer
PA1169, 2M1281
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sam christie

United Kingdom
2425 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  00:23:50  Show Profile
Lew I cannot see the 'dimming control' in this (the second) picture. Where is it?



This is a 'dimming control' as seen in the third picture on a very late M-type. It looks like a pull switch.






Sam
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LewPalmer

USA
2555 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  01:49:49  Show Profile
Sorry, Sam. I meant the third picture. You have nailed it with the last photo.

Lew Palmer
PA1169, 2M1281
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Blue M

United Kingdom
1059 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  08:13:12  Show Profile
That doesn't look like an ordinary switch. Perhaps there was some kind of rheostat behind it? The knob itself is very Rotax in appearance - are there Rotax catalogues that can be investigated?
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sam christie

United Kingdom
2425 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  09:32:02  Show Profile
Ian I wondered if the knob turned to work a rheostat or simply operated as a pull switch. There is similar example on Andy King's M-type MV 12 (2m 2805) but it appears to have been modified to take a toggle switch. To me this suggests a simple 'on off' function.





The illustrations of the period seem to use the term 'dimming control' for what we call a dip switch. This Magna illustration shows what I mean.





My guess is that the earlier cars had no dip function at all (hence the wiring diagrams not showing one) and the polite driver simply turned off his headlights if he believed he was dazzling the oncoming motorist.




Sam
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Fergus

United Kingdom
61 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  10:20:19  Show Profile
quote:
[i]






Sam



I wonder if this is the same switch as the "Light Pull On" switch from the main dash panel, with an adaptor plate to allow it to be used on the dash board? The knobs look very similar, as does the bolt pattern (for the two mounting screws closest to the knob).

Fergus

Edited by - Fergus on 30/06/2020 10:36:59
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Fergus

United Kingdom
61 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  10:21:38  Show Profile




Fergus
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sam christie

United Kingdom
2425 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  11:50:54  Show Profile
Well spotted Fergus. This is the light switch on the same car compared with the dimmer switch. It seems a light switch has been rotated by 90 ° .





The photograph these images have been extracted from was taken in 1931.

Sam
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Blue M

United Kingdom
1059 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2020 :  13:10:22  Show Profile
The M light switch has a winding behind it, which while nothing to do with the switch, could perhaps have been incorporated as a rheostat? I notice too, that the drawing of the F dimmer shows a much larger item than the usual dip switch. I think a proper dimmer would have been too fancy for early M Types which most likely had an on/off switch. Of course I could be wrong but it's a bit strange that no one has ever seen one.
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sam christie

United Kingdom
2425 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2020 :  12:51:37  Show Profile

The parts list contains some interesting information -





The only combined horn and dip switch I can see listed for the two seater commences at chassis 2251. Is this when the Clarion horn was first fitted to the front apron?

As an aside the Coupé has a ring type "horn switch" up to chassis 2603. (Has anyone ever seen one?)








Replaced on the Coupé at chassis 2604 with a combined horn switch arm & dipping switch.





Sam
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